[clue] Impressions on 11.04?

Matt Dew marcoz at osource.org
Sat Apr 30 12:07:41 MDT 2011


On 04/30/2011 08:57 AM, Kevin Fenzi wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Apr 2011 15:35:51 -0600
> Matt Dew<marcoz at osource.org>  wrote:
>
>> On 04/29/2011 02:25 PM, adam bultman wrote:
>>> Ubuntu is*easy*.  That's the beauty. I spend more time working than
>>> I do tweaking things.  That's a good thing, for me anyway.
>>>
>>
>> This is why Ubuntu is the most popular desktop distro and eventually
>> will win on the server.
>
> I don't think the two always follow there. ;)
Not always, but I wouldn't discount it.
It's very possible Ubuntu won't win on the server, but I do think 
they'll start making life uncomfortable for Redhat.  (Win may be the 
wrong word here, but my point is large user share.)

But I do know and will place money on, easy wins out.  Packages are like 
distro installations,  the easier they are, the more people like them.

Ubuntu has some smart people working for them.   I've met some in 
person, they're sharp guys.  And canonical wants in the server arena, 
that's where the money is. It takes time and if they don't get 
distracted by this whole Unity desktop vs gnome thing,  they _will_ 
start eating into Redhat's market.

> What desktop users want and what server users want sometimes don't
> overlap too much.

True, but in this case, ease of installation, I fail to see why the two 
are mutually exclusive.

>
> ...snip...
>
>> Example:
>>     Install mysql server.
>>
>> On rhel5 (I think 6 is stil the same), you still have to manually
>> change the mysql root password.
>>
>> ubuntu pops up a window (or ncurses screen in text mode) and asks you
>> for an admin password DURING THE INSTALL.
>>
>>
>> Yes, I know this particular polish is a debian thing, but it's this
>> little polish that the other distros don't think is a big deal is why
>> so many people use Ubuntu.
>>
>> It's only a couple extra easy steps right?  Multiple that by all the
>> things you do on all the machines you do them on.
>
> I personally find the rpm feature of not soliciting user imput on
> install/upgrade nice. ;)

You'd think the package managers would have options for these things. 
It might be really useful, if you could pass in arguments:

apt-get install mysql-server --root-passwd=mynewpass


Maybe 10 different package managers isn't enough, maybe we need an 11th. 
  :)


>
> Picture the above, but trying to install on 10 machines. Wouldn't it be
> nicer to just install and then script setting up the root mysql pass?

How many businesses/places/users have 10 mysql servers?  (Compared to 
the # that have 1 mysql server?)

> Or perhaps you are just dumping your own db there with it's already set
> password and asking you to set one is a waste of time. ;)

I'm not arguing that this is not an important feature. It is.  I don't 
want to lose this ability.  But does it have to be one or the other?
Right now that seems to be the way it is,  you either get a popup asking 
for a password (easy for avg user),
or you have to config afterwards (easier for sysadmin)
Why does it have to be this way?

My day job isn't a Linux admin.  We're a small shop and we all share the 
admin tasks.  These little config scripts eat up my time. I've got other 
things to do. I'll go with the easier to use and I'm not afraid to spend 
money to do it.

There are a LOT of places that have 1 or 2 servers or just run 
everything on their one computer or laptop.  Simple software 
installation NEEDS to be easy.   They're not gonna script.  These little 
details matter.

>
> Anyhow, use what you like and works for you.

I do, :)
Cheers,

P.S.  Don't misunderstand me. I'm not interested in Ubuntu/Canonical 
getting the largest share of the server market.  I'm interested in other 
distros learning and understanding why Ubuntu is so popular on the 
desktop, and then applying that to their stuff.  Then everyone wins.


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