[CLUE-Tech] FreeBSD [was Re: Nessus]

[Collins Richey]

On Sat, 16 Aug 2003 11:20:12 -0400 (EDT)
black at galaxy.silvren.com wrote:

> Yes, a "slice" is the equivalent to a "partition" in the
> linux/dos/winders/whatever world.
> 
> BSD further confuses it by just calling extended partitions
> "partitions."
> 
> When I set up BSD I used two primary partitions, and then put a few
> extended partitions under each for /, /var, /tmp, /usr and swap. There
> are still 2 primary partitions left to install Linux or whatever else.
> 
> Thanks to everyone for the great FreeBSD info. I didn't know about the
> port stuff, that's really awesome. I got X working without basically
> no fuss, and I have to agree that it's a hell of a lot quicker not
> loading all the KDE/Gnome gunk. twm may not look cool, but it does
> what I need. Maybe I'll try fluxbox.
> 

Thanks to you, David, and others who have cleared up my misunderstanding
of the FreeBSD partition handling stuff.  My knowledge is quite dated. 

> I did try gentoo, and didn't think it was worth all the fuss of
> compiling from scratch. It was certainly interesting though.
> 
> Anyone see the sloashdot post about how they compared a custom built
> gentoo system vs. a mandrake and (I think redhat) install? For
> whatever reason the gentoo box was slower on most everything, hardware
> being equal. Seems like an anomaly, but it raised my eyebrows
> nonetheless.
> 

I'm not interested in starting a flame war of any sort, but gentoo is
what I have used 90% of the time for the past 3 years, and it meets all
my needs (yours may differ).  I have no quarrel with those who
prefer Redhat, Mandrake, Slackware, SuSE, etc.  Here are some final
comments, and then I'll shut up.

1) Gentoo (the initial install) can be "a lot of fuss compiling from
scratch", but once you have gotten over the hump it's heavenly. There's
also "a lot of fuss" getting used to the gentoo way of doing boot
scripts, etc.  As an alternative approach, you can now order a CD with
almost everything you need (quite current), install the system from
binaries in a few hours, and upgrade to more current source versions
gradually.

2) I've installed and run Redhat and Mandrake on my home desktop system,
and I can say categorically that I find no speed differences.  The
Mandrake systems are much slower to boot up and reach usability state,
because Mandrake installs and starts by default every daemon known to
mankind.  I've read the slashdot article, and I'm sure that the
comparison is not based on a carefully structured benchmark.  That being
said, the old red hering about hand-customized software (faster) vs.
middle of the road customization (slower) is overinflated.  Not
necessarily so.

3) The principal reason that I stick with gentoo is not speed of
execution, but rather ease of maintenance.  Based on relatively poor
experience with RPM based systems, I find the portage system a delight. 
I found that Redhat (for example, probably true of Mandrake as well)
offered a good system for maintaining the "core gnu-linux" requirements,
but if I wanted something new and exciting I had to search widely for an
RPM that was compatible with the Redhat structure (same applies to
Mandrake, I'm sure).  Gentooers call this "RPM hell".  With gentoo, all
I need to do is wait a few days and someone will have packaged what I'm
looking for as an ebuild (the basic gentoo install-from-source-or-from-
binay package). Yes there is a delay while it compiles, but so what. 

4) With gentoo, I get the free services of a world-wide team of subject
matter experts who are continually tinkering with the latest versions of
pick-a-package (not just the core offerings) and making it work for me. 
Many, if not most, of the correspondents on the gentoo-user list and
the gentoo forums are sysadmin types, so I am assured of getting a rapid
answer to the most esoteric questions.

5) Gentoo takes a middle of the road approach to stable versus
experimental software.  Unlike Debian, where stable means thoroughly
cooked on every platform (not just x86) and frequently years behind
current development, the gentoo stable branch (for each platform) means
that the software has gone through basic quality assurance and has been
in the development repository long enough without major trouble reports.
As a result, Dan Robbins (the chief architect) does not currently
recommend his product for server use.  This caveat notwithstanding,
many people run rock solid gentoo servers.  Gentoo does pay careful
attention to exploits and releases security warnings at the same rate as
other major players. 

6) One of the shortcomings of gentoo is the initial install process. 
There is not yet available the sort of slick gui installer (a project is
under way) you are familiar with from Redhat or Mandrake.  People have
complained that it is difficult to install gentoo for multiple systems. 
This is only a partial truth.  Currently you need to roll your own
method of maintaining a common install base and rolling it out to
multiple systems.  All the tools are there, and it is possible to do
this and the methods are documented, but you have to put it all together
yourself.

7) In addition to install-from-source, gentoo makes available binary
packages for things like OpenOffice, Mozilla, and proprietary packages. 
Gentoo has a free software core, but unlike Debian there is no
preaching about the evils of closed software, and binary versions of
proprietary packages are offered wherever someone has seen the need to
develop an ebuild.  I personally like the gentoo structure where all
compiled-from-source software is installed in /usr and binary packages
are installed in /opt leaving /usr/local for truly local things.  If I
find anything in /usr/local, I know that I put it there.

8) In summary, I like to stay behind the bleeding edge but relatively
current, and gentoo makes this almost painless.  I currently run the
2.6.testn kernels, and I have the most current "relatively stable"
versions of kde, gnome, cups, gimp, apache, MySQL, Postgresql, etc. up
and running  I'm currently running Mozilla Firebird from the binaries
because not all the plugin software has caught up to GCC 3.2+, and
gentoo offers a compatibility package for software that isn't ready for
more current versions of glibc and gcc.

9) Gentoo is effectively the lazy man's approach to software.

FreeBSD (where this discussion started) is also a good product, but I'm
too lazy to use it, and they can't (yet) support the broad variety of
peripherals that any linux distro does.

Enjoy,
-- 
Collins Richey - Denver Area
if you fill your heart with regrets of yesterday and the 
worries of tomorrow, you have no today to be thankful for.